Fictional Satanic Characters | Forum

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Baphomets Mod
Baphomets Jun 27 '21
Judas Iscariot
Wolfie
Wolfie Jun 28 '21
Baphomets, the more I think about it, the more I like Judas Iscariot as a Satanist. And of course the stories are fiction.



talisman
talisman Jun 28 '21
Wolfie, you're not Judas, just consider.
Wolfie
Wolfie Jun 28 '21

Quote from talisman Wolfie, you're not Judas, just consider.


Tom Riddle
Tom Riddle Jun 28 '21
Voldemort from Harry Potter. 

As a child he preferred to operate on his own and had no cause above himself. The pure blood supremacy regime cause was just to ensure his followers loyalty. Deep inside Voldemort never cared about politics but to live forever and become the most powerful he could be, to reach his full potential so to speak.

The Forum post is edited by Tom Riddle Jun 28 '21
Brother Shamus
Brother Shamus Jun 28 '21
Ah, yes, prison snitches and people that stab people in the back to serve themselves without respect to any code of honor also identify with this character.


Does that make it satanic though? 


There are tons of christian evangelist ministers that will primarily serve themselves too. Especially the embezzling/murdering/child trafficking ones. There are tons of different beliefs with primarily self serving egomaniacs among their adherents. 


Shouldn't there be some ethical reason BEYOND just serving oneself? 

The Forum post is edited by Brother Shamus Jun 28 '21
Wolfie
Wolfie Jun 28 '21
Brother Shamus, first consider my compilation of Satan's Twelve Apostles. See pic.


Now let's consider Voldemort in light of these twelve. Take the first four first. Voldemort excels in all except materialism, and with regard to that exception, we must remember that he lives in a universe where magic is real, so it would be irrational for him (in that universe) to be a materialist.


Now take the second four. He excels in all four except possibly catharsis, but I would argue that his magic rituals have in fact provided him with catharsis, and to that extent have helped form his psyche.


Finally, let's take the last four. I would say he clearly excels in all of these.


So yes, Voldemort is a good example of a fictional Satanic character. Tom was right to propose him.


Now: Does this mean that all arch villains, or even, perhaps, all criminals, are Satanists? Hardly. Many's the criminal, and even the arch villain, who would rank poorly in rationality, empiricism, or catharsis, just to name the most obvious.


Furthermore: Must all Satanists be arch villains, or even criminals? Hardly. I'm neither, and I'm a Satanist. Neither villainy nor criminality are among the Twelve Apostles of the Lord of Hell.




Brother Shamus
Brother Shamus Jun 28 '21
I wish I actually knew the character. I just assumed being the Harry Potter antagonist, he's an honorless cutthroat jackass that will do anything to save themselves from oblivion. 


For the same reason one could make the argument Batman is more Satanic than the villains he fights. 


I just can't find a person willing to do anything to save themselves as standing apart from the herd.  


While those 12 are absolutely valid, there's a further ethical standard that need be applied. 

The Forum post is edited by Brother Shamus Jun 28 '21
Baphomets Mod
Baphomets Jun 28 '21
The Poky Little Puppy



RobLaQuq
RobLaQuq Jun 29 '21
I would like to nominate Alex in A Clockwork Orange

He is most definitely playing The Devil´s game 

The Forum post is edited by RobLaQuq Jun 29 '21
Tom Riddle
Tom Riddle Jun 29 '21
Quote from WolfieVoldemort excels in all except materialism, and with regard to that exception, we must remember that he lives in a universe where magic is real, so it would be irrational for him (in that universe) to be a materialist.

Voldemort is not materialist but he is carnal. It has been discussed in HP fan community about Voldemort's sexuality or lacks of. Some argue that Voldemort have no lust at all while others argue that Voldemort's sexual lust is sadism. It pleasures him to dominate, manipulate and tortures others. It's pure evil yes but it is carnal.



Quote from Wolfie

Furthermore: Must all Satanists be arch villains, or even criminals? 


If we take Grindelwald for instance who is a dark wizard like Voldemort I would say he is NOT satanic because despite his terrorism and cruelty it's all done in the Greater Good as it was called. Grindelwald is therefore not his own god like Voldemort as he has an ideal above himself. He also focus on the collective by gaining so many followers as possible while Voldemort only wants a very small amount of followers as he needed people to restore his body if he died (he made horcruxes you know). 
Wolfie
Wolfie Jun 29 '21
Brother Shamus:


For the Satanist, standing apart from the herd can manifest in any of three ways:

1. Means to an end

2. End in itself

3. Side-effect


In the case of LaVey, the analysis would look like this:

1. Means to an end: LaVey made standing apart from the herd into a highly effective marketing tool.

2. End in itself: LaVey didn't need to make standing apart from the herd into an end in itself, because for him, everything he was and did set him apart.

3. Side-effect: LaVey, simply by being himself, caused the side effect of standing apart from the herd.


In my own case, the analysis would look like this:

1. Means to an end: I don't do this. I don't "weaponize" standing apart from the herd.

2. End in itself: I don't do this. I don't need to. My way of thinking (in environments where I reveal it) sets me apart, whether I seek that outcome or not. Meanwhile, there are environments where I see no advantage to standing apart. Blending in works better.

3. Side-effect: All I do (in certain environments) is express my truth. Because I'm an original thinker, expressing my truth has the side-effect of setting me apart.

  

Where ethics are concerned, l would offer the well-known Dungeons & Dragons matrix as a way of structuring our discussion. See pic.


The Satanist will most naturally gravitate to chaotic, neutral, and evil. The chaotic alignments are natural because of the pillars of atavism. The evil alignments are natural because of the pillars of misanthropy. The neutral alignments are natural because of the pillars of modernism. The lawful and good alignments are unnatural for the Satanist.

   

So four of the nine squares are likely positions for the Satanist. These are: Neutral Neutral, Chaotic Neutral, Neutral Evil, and Chaotic Evil.


I myself am Neutral Neutral. LaVey was Chaotic Neutral. 



Tom Riddle
Tom Riddle Jun 29 '21
Do you say that the practice of Satanism is about misanthropy?
Wolfie
Wolfie Jun 29 '21
Tom, yes, one of the three cardinal elements of Satanism as I practice it is misanthropy. The other two are modernism and atavism.



Brother Shamus
Brother Shamus Jun 29 '21
The Satanist will most naturally gravitate to chaotic, neutral, and evil. The chaotic alignments are natural because of the pillars of atavism. The evil alignments are natural because of the pillars of misanthropy. The neutral alignments are natural because of the pillars of modernism. The lawful and good alignments are unnatural for the Satanist.


I always ended up "neutral or chaotic evil" on that one. And while expected, I find the character of Voldemort to be a little honorless bitch. The type of person whose ends always justify means without apparent self respect. No honor among thieves applies. 


Let's put it in a Cosa Nostra reference. A mafia organization could absolutely find itself classified much like the persona of Voldemort or even a Keyser Soze. In it for money, kin, cloak and dagger user of people, and fuck the morality of society. True self serving entities within their own right. 


Where did Omerta come from?  The egotistic self serving are the types to rat out the family to cut a better deal.  Everyone does that. Means justifying ends just became entirely ordinary. 


Let's put in a more personalized context: 


Could you pretend to be subverient to an ideal, like compulsory culture, for prominence in that society. For wealth. For power. What if it was a Third Reich dynamic you had to promote. Would you be able to be a Nazi for the self serving ends and powerful position in society?


Or would you go all Oskar Schindler about shit? 

The Forum post is edited by Brother Shamus Jun 29 '21
Wolfie
Wolfie Jun 29 '21
Brother Shamus, I could pretend to be anything if it served my purposes and I had the talent to pull it off. But there are limits to what I'd be willing to do. I can be severe in retaliation or out of disgust, but torturing random people just isn't in me.


As for not being ordinary: Voldemort was the greatest magician of his day, and Hermione (another Harry Potter character) is the greatest magician of hers. Being elite in some discipline is the truest way I know to achieve the status of being extra-ordinary.


One of the most fundamental disciplines is that of simply thinking. Non-academic philosophy, in fact, is nothing other than the science and art of thinking. I've made it my life's ambition to become elite in non-academic philosophy. Satanism is how I'm attempting to do that.


I'm not the only person on this message board who is attempting to become elite in the science and art of thinking.


Tom Riddle
Tom Riddle Jun 29 '21
Quote from Wolfieand Hermione (another Harry Potter character) is the greatest magician of hers.

Disagree. Bellatrix was more powerful. 
Wolfie
Wolfie Jun 29 '21
Tom, in the context I'm using it, "day" means generation. Voldemort was the greatest magician of his generation. Hermione is the greatest of hers. Bellatrix is not of Hermione's generation.



Brother Shamus
Brother Shamus Jun 29 '21
Quote from Wolfie

But there are limits to what I would be willing to do.


Exactly.  Call it proto-morality. There is a code of personal ethics in play with even the most chaotic evil. There is personal honor  along with self serving ends. 


Take Lucifer.  The ideals were beyond service of self primarily. While driven by ego, it was specifically nepotism and hypocrisy.  You cant apply this double standard to me! I feel beyond the rise to power and self adulation there is an adversity trigger along personal lines that needs to be present. 


Otherwise Lucifer/Satan would have just shined god on and worked some self-serving cloak and dagger shit.  It's weakness of character for the sake of will. Where's the integrity? 


On that honor. I interpret it as "what you can feel pride with yourself doing".  When I post scientific data I have to fact check it. Why? Because simply making myself the superior argument at all costs is bitch shit. For these same proto-moral reasons. Integrity mainly. 


There's more than just trying to be the best and seeking the throne of influence IMO. 


The Forum post is edited by Brother Shamus Jun 29 '21
Tom Riddle
Tom Riddle Jun 29 '21
Quote from Wolfie Tom, yes, one of the three cardinal elements of Satanism as I practice it is misanthropy. The other two are modernism and atavism

What do you mean with misanthropy in this context? 
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